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is a router REALLY necessary?

Discussion in 'Firewalls and Networks' started by slongo, Jan 12, 2005.

  1. slongo

    slongo Techie7 New Member

    hi everyone, hope you can help me since i've scoured google but seem unable to come up with a simple yes or no to my question.

    despite being more than conversant with computers the whole "networking" area is new territory for me and i don't wanna end up blowing cash i haven't got on needless hardware just so my relatives can surf the net!!

    my question is this, say for example i have two pc's:
    windows xp pro
    wireless network card (belkin 802.11g wireless desktop network card - internal)
    internet access (via an external usb adsl modem on freeserve/wanadoo)

    windows xp pro
    wireless network card (belkin 802.11g wireless desktop network card - internal)

    can i share the internet connection of pc1 for use on pc2 using ONLY a wireless network card in each? (and assuming that both pc's will need to be switched on when internet access is required by pc2?)

    it seems like a very simple question/idea but i've been unable to find an answer as most tutorials/forums always suggest the use of a router also.

    also if it is indeed possible to do it this way, could someone provide a quick and basic description of what steps should be followed to achieve this once both pci network cards are installed?

    thank you for your time in advance!
    slong :)
  2. AphJN

    AphJN Dedicated Member

    A router is easier than using Internet Connection Sharing that is available in Win 2000/XP Pro. I have tried both and found the router much more reliable and stable. (I found info on it in the Windows Help and Support Center searching under Internet Connection Sharing)

    The advantage I found with a router is that it adds an extra layer of firewall protection to your home connection. Routers are not all that expensive now compared to a few years ago. If this is just a temporary deal, then ICS can be a good way to go.

    Let me know if this helped.

  3. spud

    spud D-A-L Team Member (UK)

    but there is one draw back the pc linked to the router needsto be turned on unless you are using wireless also check out this link

    hope this helps
  4. slongo

    slongo Techie7 New Member

    the second pc, the one without an internet connection, is really not used terribly often and even then i would say stability is really not of importance for the sake of only very occasional internet access and maybe the odd file sent back and forth. as long as it works some of the time then they can't grumble since i'm paying for everything lol

    thanks for the link, i'll have a read when the network cards arrive but it all sounds fairly straightforward i was just unsure as to whether it was easily do-able without a router or not.

    thanks for the help
  5. DJNafey

    DJNafey UK site moderator

    If you don't find what you need in the Windows Help And Support Center (is that's XP's flashy new name for "the help file"?!), then go to http://support.microsoft.com. Using the menu on the left-hand side, you can look for technical articles about setting up networking and Internet Connection Sharing. Microsoft's online articles are really very good.
  6. jephree

    jephree ¨*·.¸ «.·°·..·°·.» ¸.·*¨


    Flashy & Fun :eek:

  7. slongo

    slongo Techie7 New Member

    to be honest i think i'm allergic to the "windows help and support center" due to a recent experience involving trying to get rid of VERY persistent spyware on someones PC and the amount of times the help and support center popped up when booting into safe mode on windows me - it did my head in!!

    thank god for tweakui for windows xp on my own computer, else all those mis-clicks on the start menu when aiming for the "run..." option would send me truly round the bend when that help center stuff brings my computer to a grinding halt! lol

    my new pc aint due til tuesday of next week so until then i may have a play with my current pc and the old pc downstairs (windows 95 - will upgrade to 98se) and the network cards and see if i can learn a few things networking-wise before doing it for real :)
  8. slongo

    slongo Techie7 New Member

    why oh why did i think it would go without a hitch? lol :)

    ok, so two pc's both running windows xp (home and pro, no sp2) installed the belkin software on both, then put in the wireless network cards.

    created a network, both pc's are connected to that network BUT in "my network places" on each pc you can only see the pc that you're sitting at.

    i've disabled the windows firewall on both, got file and printer sharing running, even shared all the hard drives but nothing.

    any ideas on why this is happening? needless to say the internet connection sharing aint happening just now - can't even ping the remote computer :mad:

  9. DJNafey

    DJNafey UK site moderator

    Are they both in the same workgroup? (Right-click My Network Places and check your Properties).

    Are they running a different subnet mask in TCP/IP?

    Have they both got the same IP address?! (Go to a command prompt and type ipconfig).
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2005
  10. slongo

    slongo Techie7 New Member

    yes yes and no.

    same workgroup, same subnet and different ip addresses - and (i believe i got a message saying that was in use by the network adapter)
  11. slongo

    slongo Techie7 New Member

    or yes no no even - my brain is fried lol ;)
  12. DJNafey

    DJNafey UK site moderator

    Isn't it normally and ?
  13. AphJN

    AphJN Dedicated Member

    Depends on your gateway what starting IP it takes...At home my gateway starts at 100 ( while my secured network goes with
  14. AphJN

    AphJN Dedicated Member

    BTW, this is why I didnt finish my ICS on the system and went with the router. I messed with this for 6 weeks and had it working for only 2 of the 6 weeks total. Now, a friend at work has it working perfectly where all 25 of his computers and Internet Appliances use his Win2k machine as the gateway no problem.
  15. slongo

    slongo Techie7 New Member

    well for now i'm gonna reinstall everything from scratch and try again tomorrow, maybe try and find an "idiots" guide later on tonight before starting...
    ...was just confused that everything went so smoothly until the point they can't see each other!

    anyhoo, i shall keep you posted with my progress but thanks for the help in the meantime people :)
  16. DJNafey

    DJNafey UK site moderator

    But they are usually 192.168.x.x aren't they AphJN? Not 192.68.x.x as Slongo said he's got.

    And, Slongo, if they're on a different subnet mask (I wasn't quite sure what your answer was to that in the end!), then they probably won't see each other. The subnet mask, as far as I know, is usually 255.255.x.x.
  17. AphJN

    AphJN Dedicated Member

    Yes, you are right about the 192.168.x.x (I checked mine to make sure) However, if the first two octets are the same it doesnt matter if the Subnet mask is
  18. slongo

    slongo Techie7 New Member

    yeah sorry i was kinda recalling the ip address(es) from memory. lol

    good news though, all working now :) i think it was a combination of the network card manual containing no information on creating and setting up a new network and ending up in a click frenzy after getting frustrated.

    reinstalled everything, thought about it a bit more, and things eventually came together fairly easily (took a lil while to get the internet connection sharing going until i found the new connection wotsit and it found my connection on the host pc).

    hint for other networking newbies: don't tackle such a thing when you've only had 6 hours sleep in the past 3 days!! ;)

    thank you everyone for your help all the same
    slongo - a happy networker
  19. Jaynee

    Jaynee Techie7 New Member

    6 hours sleep in the past 3 days!! That much........you lucky thing. ;)
    Come one everyone take a bow........ ROFL
  20. DJNafey

    DJNafey UK site moderator

    Glad to hear you got it sorted :)