Hi,
Just built a PC for the first time in 8 years and I am having a problem with nearly all the games I tested so far. Most of the games crash the computer forcing it to reboot. I have tried two different OS, updating the video card drivers, unplugging components, double and triple checking the hardware....

Here are my specs:
Motherboard: GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3P LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard
CPU + fan: Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 Yorkfield 2.83GHz LGA 775 95W Quad-Core Processor Model BX80569Q9550
Case: RAIDMAX SMILODON ATX-612WBP Black 1.0mm SECC Steel ATX Mid Tower Foldout MB Computer Case With 500W Power Supply
RAM: Kingston HyperX 2GB 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 Desktop Memory Model KHX8500D2/2G
HD: Western Digital Caviar Blue WD6400AAKS 640GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5"
Graphics card: EVGA 896-P3-1257-AR GeForce GTX 260 Core 216 Superclocked Edition 896MB 448-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI
CD/DVD: LG 22X DVD±R DVD Burner Black IDE Model GH22NP20 - OEM

OS tried: Vista-64bits and XP pro with Service pack 3.
Drivers: Most up to date graphic card drivers.

Here are the games that do not work: Half Life 2 (steam), HL2 lost coast (steam), HL2 Episode 1 (steam), Neverwinter Nights (retail), Call of duty 5 (retail).
Games that work fine: Max Payne (does not install in Vista, XP only, retail), Jade Empire (steam)

Type of error encountered: games will crash once the game starts to play or sometimes even in game menus. The higher the resolution and video card effects, the quicker the crash occurs. If I lower the resolution and game effects, I can play sometimes for a few minutes before the system reboots.
- HL2 min settings. Played for awhile without problems.
- HL2 max settings: crashes on menu, crashes nearly immeditaly in game
- HL2 lost coast: played at max settings for a good 10 minutes before crash the first time.
- HL2 ep1: crashed on first screen at max settings, then second attempt crashed on introduction
- Call of duty 5: crashed on menu, at the end of the first loading, during the intro, a few seconds into gameplay, and a few minutes into gameplay
- Neverwinter nights: on anything but max settings, it crashes when you select the start a new game and then go to the module screen. I managed to start a new game but setting the game to minamal settings, then changing them in game and it crashed after about 10 minutes.
- Jade empire: worked perfectly for four hours straight. Seemed faster in Vista.
- Max Payne (XP only): worked fine on max settings.

Solutions tried: - Ram: tried with one of the two sticks of ram, and then with the other. Both times the games crashed.
- Tried installing the drives for the video card again
- DirectX was updated to Dx10
- Tried different OS
- Tried changing graphic card settings from nvidia control
- Monitored CPU temp on the cores. Seemed fine.
- Tested graphic card with a software called Fur (something like that). Results seemed good. Graphic card Fan started to kick in at around 80 F. Remained at around 88 f. System was stable.

Clues: before the PC reboots, I can deffinatly hear something in the PC go super fast and make more noise than normal. It sounds like a fan but I can't tell if it is the one on the CPU or the one in the Power unit.

All the rest of the PC works fine. No problems with the net or watching Netflix movies streamed. Music is good too. I do not know why certain games work on Max settings without problems, but others have trouble even on low resolutions. Neverwinter Nights and Half life 2 are both old games and the much more recent Jade empire works without a hitch.
It seems like it could be an overheating of something in the case but the case does not feel warm. Perhaps the CPU overheats or the Power unit is not powerful enough?

Hi Thriceborn and welcome.

If you fire up the computer and use it for hours and hours, but don't play any games, will it crash?

You say the CPU temps are fine - but did not post them. What are your CPU temps and note that computer temps are normally displayed in °C, and not °F. You might try blasting a desk fan into the open interior while testing to see if it happens too.

When mounting the CPU, did you use TIM?

Originally Posted by Digerati

Hi Thriceborn and welcome.

If you fire up the computer and use it for hours and hours, but don't play any games, will it crash?

You say the CPU temps are fine - but did not post them. What are your CPU temps and note that computer temps are normally displayed in °C, and not °F. You might try blasting a desk fan into the open interior while testing to see if it happens too.

When mounting the CPU, did you use []TIM[/url]?

Thanks for the welcome.
To answer your questions:
- I have not experienced a single crash outside of games.

- Now I am not at home so I can't say for certain, but I believe the CPU temp was around 48 to 50. I cannot remember if this was in celcius or farenheit. I used a third party piece of software for this. These temps were right before I launched the game. The temp on the first core was always 2 or 3 degrees higher than on the other three cores.
I don't have a desk fan to try what you offered however.

- The fan did come with some thermal paste but I do not know how effective it was (brand, age, quantity). I also got some smeared on my fingers because I did not see it at first (had some trouble mounting the fan).

One other problem I encounted: when jade empire configurations scans my PC in Vista before launching the game, it always crashes. It worked fine in XP however.

Well, a proper application of TIM is critical. Note that a computer's temperature cannot be colder than the air in the room - so unless you live live in a refridgerator, it is not likely your room temperature is 50°F.

50°C is a nice, safe CPU temperature.

A small desk fan is inexpensive - or perhaps you could borrow one.

Since it only happens with games - just about the most demanding tasks you can ask of a computer, heat is the primary suspect. Though it could also be RAM, graphics drivers, or a failing PSU, among other things.

You can test RAM using one of the following programs. Both require you to create and boot to a bootable floppy disk or CD to run the diagnostics. Using the floppy method is generally easier (and another reason to include floppy drives in new builds). However, the CD method is just as effective at detecting RAM problems. Allow the diagnostics to run for several passes or even overnight. You should have no reported errors.

Windows Memory Diagnostic - see the easy to follow instructions under Quick Start Information.
or
MemTest86+ (for more advanced users) - an excellent how-to guide is available here.

Alternatively, you could install a single RAM module and try running with that to see if it fails. Repeat process with remaining modules, hopefully identifying the bad stick through a process of elimination.

Originally Posted by Digerati

You can test RAM using one of the following programs. Both require you to create and boot to a bootable floppy disk or CD to run the diagnostics. Using the floppy method is generally easier (and another reason to include floppy drives in new builds). However, the CD method is just as effective at detecting RAM problems. Allow the diagnostics to run for several passes or even overnight. You should have no reported errors.

Alternatively, you could install a single RAM module and try running with that to see if it fails. Repeat process with remaining modules, hopefully identifying the bad stick through a process of elimination.

I already tried pulling out one of the RAM module's and then pulling it out and putting back the other. Both times the PC still crashed.

I will try the memory tests later today.

Is there anything else I can do to narrow down the list of suspects (PSU, heat, RAM, drivers)?

One thing that really bugs me is that that some games work fine but others do not. I would have thought that Jade Empire or Max Payne would require more resources than Neverwinter Nights for instance.

Is there anything else I can do to narrow down the list of suspects (PSU, heat, RAM, drivers)?

Well, I mentioned heat, RAM, graphics drivers, and the PSU. You need to check EVGA for new graphics drivers. Here's my canned text on testing PSUs.

To properly and conclusively test a power supply unit (PSU), it must be tested under various realistic "loads" then analyzed for excessive ripple and other anomalies. This is done by a qualified technician using an oscilloscope or power analyzer - sophisticated (and expensive) electronic test equipment requiring special training to operate, and a basic knowledge of electronics theory to understand the results. Therefore, conclusively testing a power supply is done in properly equipped electronic repair facilities.

Fortunately, there are other options that are almost as good. I keep a FrozenCPU Ultimate PSU Tester in my tool bag when I am "in the field" and don't have a good spare power supply to swap in. While not a certain test, they are better than nothing. The advantage of this model is that it has an LCD readout of the voltage. With an actual voltage readout, you have a better chance of detecting a "failing" PSU, or one barely within specified ATX Form Factor Standard tolerances. Lesser models use LEDs to indicate the voltage is just within some "range". These are less informative, considerably cheaper, but still useful for detecting PSUs that have already "failed". Newegg has several testers to choose from. All these testers contain a "dummy load" to fool the PSU into thinking it is connected to a motherboard, and therefore allows the PSU to power on, if able, without being attached to a motherboard - great for testing fans, but again, it is not a true load or suitable for conclusive testing.

As mentioned, swapping in a known good supply is a tried and trued method of troubleshooting used for centuries, even by pros. Remove the "suspect" part and replace with a "known good" part and see if the problem goes away.

I do not recommend using a multimeter to test power supplies. To do it properly, that is, under a realistic load, the voltages on all the pins must be measured while the PSU is attached to the motherboard and the computer powered on. This requires poking (with some considerable force) two hard and sharp, highly conductive meter probes into the main power connector, deep in the heart of the computer. One tiny slip can destroy the motherboard, and everything plugged into it. It is not worth the risk considering most multimeters, like plug-in testers, do not measure, or reveal any unwanted and potentially disruptive AC components to the DC voltages.

And remember, anything that plugs into the wall can kill. Do not open the power supply's case unless you are a qualified electronics technician. There are NO user serviceable parts inside a power supply.

Tested the RAM and found no errors. I ran it all last night.

Also tried running games in windowed mode so I could see the Core temps and they all seemed within normal range. The highest I saw before the computer crashed was 72C on the Core 1.

One thing I found interesting was that game intro to HL2ep1 was running fine in windowed mode while the game was not active (I could see the demo continue, but I had the CPU temp window active and not the game) but as soon as I re-activated the game's window, the PC rebooted.

I am quite frankly at my wits end and I am thinking of turning this in to Best Buy or something (although I am sceptical they can figure this out too).

Well, it does act like RAM, or graphics drivers. But 72°C gives me concern too.

You take your chances with Best Buy - some are staffed with qualified, good people, some are not. But there's no shame in taking the PC to a shop. Some times the only way we can really figure out what is wrong is to get our own fingers in there. Long distance troubleshooting has its limitations.

Originally Posted by Digerati

Well, I mentioned heat, RAM, graphics drivers, and the PSU. You need to check EVGA for new graphics drivers. Here's my canned text on testing PSUs.
....

And remember, anything that plugs into the wall can kill. Do not open the power supply's case unless you are a qualified electronics technician. There are NO user serviceable parts inside a power supply.

Wow I am impressed. This is certainly something far beyond my abilities to do so I won't try. The last time I was in an electricity class, I got a 1/20 grade on my final paper. My mechanics class was not much better.

Well, it does act like RAM, or graphics drivers. But 72°C gives me concern too.

Well I used their most updated drivers on their website. I tried the Vista-64 bits version under Vista, and I installed the XP 32bits under XP.
Under both OS, I used direct X10. Didn't see where I could load an earlier version. Weird since I thought DX10 was a vista exclusive.

You take your chances with Best Buy - some are staffed with qualified, good people, some are not. But there's no shame in taking the PC to a shop. Some times the only way we can really figure out what is wrong is to get our own fingers in there. Long distance troubleshooting has its limitations.

Any recommendations for the Charlotte, NC area? I am just south of Charlotte in SC. Not that I really want to spend $250 on a computer to have it fixed, but if all else fails.

I would try switching out components if I had any spares, but alas, my old PC had only a 350Watt power supply which I am certain is not enough for the graphics card (recommends a 500watt which is what I have). My old graphic card doesn't seen to fit in any of the slots either.